1. Important - the 2n3904 (I used 2N5088) must be matched. I made them exactly the same hFE.
2. Change 680R to 4.7K (gets rid of the oscillation problem)
3. The 1M that's going from JFET Gate (the one that goes down to the second last row, change it to 1.8K
2. Change 680R to 4.7K (gets rid of the oscillation problem)
3. The 1M that's going from JFET Gate (the one that goes down to the second last row, change it to 1.8K
I don't think the hFE matters, as long as it's matched. I haven't tried lower hFE. Mine are medium/high.. can't remember
Changing the 1M to 1.8K gets the level back to normal
First, the stock version with only the sensitivity/threshold control (it is called sensitivity in the Tonepad project files):
Then the highly modded one. With added controls for Attack, Release and Attenuation levels. Also, added momentary single pole stomp switch - This one acts as a momentary kill switch for gate.
finished the modded version and i guess you can tag it. although attenuation might be in reverse depending on how you like things, it mutes more and more the more you turn it counter-clockwise.
ReplyDeleteim also unsure about the knobs, attack and release dosnt seem to do that much for me, might be my ears to. sensitivity does nothing really and attenuation gates the signal more and more. will prob strip it down to the unmodded version.
setting the noisegate last in chain the sens works better as well as the rest of the knobs but it lowers the volume to much there. you loose alot of power.
DeleteGreat! Thanks redeez! I'll tag it right away.
Delete+m
I was looking at the schematics and it looks like the Sens 1 1k resistor is connected to ground instead of Vb as shown in the schematics. Which one is correct?
ReplyDeleteYou're right. There was an error. I fixed it for both versions with little tweaking.
Delete+m
Hey guys, I finished the stock version the other night, then I came here to check a few things(as I do) and realised I must've printed the layout before it was changed. Anyway, no big deal! I changed my board around without a fuss but it still isn't working the way it should be. I cranked the gain on one of my pedals to get a bit of noise going and the pot did nothing up until about 2o'clock, where it seemed to cut some of the noise. But up to that spot and after it, the control seemed to be doing nothing. I'm quite confident that everything is where it should be and there are no bridges etc. Here are my voltages. Battery: 8.79v
ReplyDeleteQ1 C 8.75v B 4.48v E 4.08v
Q2 E 0.00v B 0.47v C This one swings from 4.23v at min, then turning the pot up to 2o'clock voltage goes down to 0.02v then back up to 4.23v for the rest of it's travel.
Q3 D 4.96v S 4.96v G 4.34v
IC(RC4558D) 1 4.94v 2 4.96v 3 4.96v 4 0.00v 5 4.23v 6 4.43v 7 4.43v 8 8.73v
Anyone got any ideas? I changed the pot thinking it might be faulty but the result is the same with the new one.
Cheers, Thommo.
I just built one and it works but it has a squealing sound. I'm gonna see if i can figure out what's wrong.
ReplyDeleteThis layout need to be updated. Here's what you need to do to get it working:
ReplyDelete1. Important - the 2n3904 (I used 2N5088) must be matched. I made them exactly the same hFE.
2. Change 680R to 4.7K (gets rid of the oscillation problem)
3. The 1M that's going from JFET Gate (the one that goes down to the second last row, change it to 1.8K
After that, the squealing went away, the gating is normal and the level is right. I've only made one with these changes but I'm about to build another one. I'd like to hear from others if it worked for them as well.
I could probably add a modded layout, but with those changes it's no longer one with the schematic.
Delete+m
I realised I had Sens 3 & 1 around the wrong way(Doh!!). So I changed them around, matched my 2n3904's and changed the resistors as suggested. Still there is no gating at all. When I switch it on there is no change at all to the original signal, no matter where the pot is set.
ReplyDeleteThommo.
That's strange. Have you checked the pinout for the JFET? Try swapping them out with others to see if there's any change.
DeleteIf you take out the JFET, the signal will still go through, so try taking it out while the guitar is playing and see what happens.
I tried your suggestions Geiri and the only thing that happened is that I got some kind of weird low fart noise that rose in pitch, that just kept on repeating itself. lol I'll check my board over again. There must be something I've done wrong somewhere. I just haven't found it yet :)
DeleteI'm at a bit of a loss with this one!! Same with the Cook reverb.
DeleteHmm.. This and that reverb seem to be uncrackable. Errors in available schematics maybe? I think no one would mind if i take these both down?
Delete+m
Yeah, not a problem mate. No point flogging a dead horse(circuit)...lol. Just wondering if you had a look at the voltages I posted for the Cook reverb? I might re-check them.
DeleteMirosol, I must say that without this vero layout I wouldn't be able to buil mine. I sugest you put some warning instead of thake it down. Other option is to "tune" this thing regardless the schematic.
Delete7-year thread-bump! Just built this. I was getting the same issues as Thommo, but for some reason I have a whole lot of 2N5952s, so I socketed that and started swapping them. It works now. Every JFET I tried in there works a little differently.
DeleteY does it look like the 1uf cap by the ic goes in a cut?
DeleteMine works realy good but I've made some changes.
ReplyDeleteI cann't remember all the changes, but I've got them wrote down at home.
I replicated the input buffer to get the "sample" from the guitar input and "cut" at the end of my gain chain (4 jacks, Input, send, return, Output)
I also used trimpots in place of the "critical" resistors (1M to the gate, 680R frim OpAmp and 150K for release) to find the best value.
I used a 1uF tantalum instead of the 1ufNP.
I belive I've done one or two more changes but I need to make sure.
It helps if you test the circuit inside a metal box, of course...
Hi, what's the orientation for the 1uf tantalium?
DeleteThanks!
I've built this twice now with those two component changes and they worked fine right away.
ReplyDeleteHey Geiri,
DeleteJust built this one up using the changes you suggested, and I get some gating, so I know it's doing something. I used 2n5088s like you did, I also used a TL072 and a 2n5485 in place of the regular components.
My problem is I'm getting a pretty low output level. It also seems to boost my treble quite a bit, not sure what that's about.
Any ideas as to why I may be getting such a weird volume/treble issue?
Thanks,
Jacob
Is that 1uF electrolytic really supposed to go into where the cut is?
ReplyDeleteOver the cut. That's one of the reasons i wanted to take this down.
Delete+m
Thanks, got it working just fine with this info and the other info stated. A little awkward with the 1uF there but I don't see any reason it should be taken down, it works right. Might want to add a note about that capacitor or update the layout to show it though.
DeleteThink i'll update it at some point...
Delete+m
Hi excuse me but i cant understand this over the cut thing. Does it means on the same strip but to the left of the cut? This would make sense, as the positive side of the cap would be affecting whatevers at the left of it. Please let me know because i skipped one column to do this and i really would like to know if it is correct like this as i wouldnt want to throw everything away. Thanks if you would kindly let me know, maybe as Jarrett said, add a note..
DeleteWhat would be the best way to add an in/out for use with the fx loop in your amp as well as using it in front of the amp simultaneously? This would isolate the preamp reducing the most noise.
ReplyDeleteHi,
ReplyDeleteI can't get pot to work. I did all the changes and revers them, but nothing. When I engage pedal it works but it cuts down the volume, and pot is not working and not doing nothing. I changed few of pots but nothing. When I remove (I have socket all of them) jfet sound is even with pedal other pedal but pot is still not responding. I have changed few of jfets bu nothing. Does anyone have any idea?
P.S. There are no solder bridges. :-)
can I replace 2n5952/2n5485 with other FET ?? please help me
ReplyDelete2sk168e
DeleteThe axial 1uF between the 1M and 100k (7th Column), just verifying that should be a ceramic/film type and not an electrolytic? (just gotta find one)
ReplyDeleteI built this and it works great, I used 2n3904 and 2sk168e for jfet. Thanks!
ReplyDeleteHello, I build this box and it`s ok, but I have problem whith switch, wenn I push on/off is heard a loud bum!!! Anyone has any solution??? I use offboard wirnig :)
ReplyDeletethere is already a 2.2M resistor from input to ground to prevent this.
Deletebut you could try some other things.1)
change your LED.
2)try an other 3pdt switch cause it could be faulty, or
3)check your supply. do you use a regulated supply?like boss or something?
I tried this things, I delete Led, change switch & use 2,2M and nothing changed.
DeleteI don`t now what is wrong :(
Hi all. If no momentary switch is used do I simply disregard the connections to it?
ReplyDeleteHello everyone.I think its mistake conect MBP2 to Atack 2&3.It does not make sense.MBP1 is o.k.When the switch is open(normally)the same as it is not there.When the switch is(ON)MBP2 switch must be connected ground to 100R resistor.I am so done and all is well.
ReplyDeleteHey all
ReplyDeleteMy question is this; does the 1uF cap near the Attack and Release pots need to be non-polarized (as stated in the schem at tonepad)?
Chris,these caps must be polarized.
ReplyDeleteUnderstood - however, like I mentioned, the schem on tonepad specifically mentions that one 1uF is non-polarized.
DeleteSee here: http://www.tonepad.com/getFileInfo.asp?id=77
Otherwise if folks have built it here per the vero w/out the NP, then that's cool and would like to know that too.
it won't make any difference at all.you can put in there anything you got.
Deletei did this in many circuits with no thinking at all, and all worked.(using 1uf polarized or non..). you just have to be sure when you're gone use a polarized in place of non-pol for+ - ..
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteChris,only non-polarized is cap 1mf that parallel with resistor 100k.The underside of the bridge leads to transistor Q1 to base.From the top via to resistor 22k to IC1(number 4 is Vcc-) and trough cap 47n direct to IC1(number 1 is output 1) and resistor 1M bridge leads to IC1(number 2 Invert input 1).All other caps 1mf are polarized electrolitics.
DeleteI do not agree with comment ElGrecos.(sorry,i do not know to write your name).
ReplyDelete
Am I suppose to connect the 4 leg from the ic to the long link? Just trying to understand the whole double link thing. Thanks
ReplyDeleteYes. To the right hand side of pin 4 there are two wires soldered in the same hole. One going up, one going down
DeleteI want to do the Attenuation level mod only. How would I go about doing something like that thanks
ReplyDeleteHola a todos... quiero saber si ya estan confiables las 2 versiones de los veroboard del noise gate para hacerlas o todavia hay problemas y no funcionan???? y el que lo haya hecho por favor confirmeme el 100% de su funcionamiento
ReplyDeleteHello everyone ... I want to know if they are reliable and the 2 versions of veroboard the noise gate to make them or there are still problems and do not work ???? and you've done please confirm if 100% of its operation
quedo atento y pendiente a la ayuda que me ofrezcan
ReplyDeletestay tuned and outstanding support offered to me
I built the mxr noise gate and the dsp decimator. If iI had to do it again I would build the dsp.
DeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteHi! Thank you for your work) Can you make layout of electro harmonix silencer?
ReplyDeleteMine works well after the mods and matching the 3904's (within 1), but the gate doesn't release smoothly when it's set fast. The gate will open and close as my guitar note decays. Not a problem if I slow down the attack and release a bit. Any ideas, or is this the nature of the beast?
ReplyDeleteIt works and eliminates the noise but
ReplyDeletei hate that decay it begins to cut so fast the signal
can you help me please i have done all the mods but i´m using a 2n5485
So hope someone could answer something
That is exactly what it is supposed to do. It will chop of the signal when using a massively loaded, hi-gain sound to prevent squeals and feedback as soon as you stop playing or release the strings - think shred metal.
ReplyDeleteThe trick is to use it in exactly the right application, and set the threshold at exactly the right point to prevent feedback, but not chop off the note too quickly. It WILL take you some time to ind the correct setting.
No matter whet the pot is set the E and B strings haven´t sound and the other ones at the end it always produces like if it cut off the signal like
ReplyDeletelaaaa-cut-aaa-cut-aa....
Build this today. I've got lots of 3904 and tryed matched and no matched, and in both cases this works. For Q3 I used 5485 instead 5952. I did what Geiri said and changed 1M to 1.8k and level now is ok. Running low with 4.7K, so I changed 680R for 8.2K and it just worked fine with no oscilations or any other problems! Boxed in a 1590B. Best regards from Brazil!
ReplyDeletethe resitor of 2.2k is not connected to the ground
ReplyDeleteDo I connect the 1mF Electro Cap (3rd row, approx middle, marked horizontal) under the leg of the 100K resistor..?
ReplyDeleteAs there is a cut where it is in the schematic now to attach the positive side...
If so, can/can not thouch each other..?
I did a test run, but getting no sound through, I think this might be my problem...
Hi will using a 2n5457 work in place of the 5485 or 5952?
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteHey,
ReplyDeleteWhat do you guys mean by matching 3904's ?
Does it mean that you have to change other components or trying different 3904's? All 3904 aren't same ?
I build this pedal but pot not working?
ReplyDeleteDoes this pedal work for bass guitar as it is or does it need modifications? thanks
ReplyDeleteI've build the modded Version to use it on my Bass guitar. The problem is that the pedal cuts away the low end. I've loked for any mistakes but I can' find anything. Do I have to adjust the entry filter for bass becaus they are adjustet for guitar, or any other Idea whats wrong ?
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteMomentary bypass switch lug 1.
Delete+m
Can I substitute the 2n5952 with the a J201?
ReplyDeleteBuilt this one and it sounds really good. I was worried at first as I thought it was filtering the low mids, but I think its ok now Ive played with it for a while.
ReplyDeleteI did the full mod version, but found the attack, release and MBP did not really enhance the noise gate use, but the Attenuation is a really great addition.
I recommend keeping the Attenuation mod and scrapping the rest. This needs you to build it as per the mods board but retain the bottom right (2 row; rows 16/17) link; you need to move it to the end of the row, (where the Attack feeds are in the full modded version). you will also need to replace the other 2 row jumper that connects attenuation 1 with row 13 (where release 2/3 are in the full mod version)
Excellent - thanks; it will go in a comp/NG/boost box
really appreciate that mod info, dude, thanks
DeleteI used Geiri's mods and Shaun Martin's suggestion of only using the attenuation mod on my build. https://puu.sh/xCWQD/28d0711755.png is the modded layout i went from.
ReplyDeleteI actually had something mildly interesting happen with mine. Upon first test my bridge pickup was working correctly, but my neck pickup was making a "fwoff fwoffsh fwosff" noise that was very loud and I couldn't figure out why. I tested other guitars and the problem was localized to this one, so I opened it up, and while i was still getting sound the neck pickup wire was hanging by a thread. I just thought it was interesting that no other pedal had issue with this. so I had no idea it wasn't working fully.
I bought a bunch of different transistors to play with in a big muff (pink flesh specifically) and measured the HFE of every single one to get the best match I could. Turned out that it was a pair of ~200 HFE 2n3904s. I don't know if my cheapo meter's HFE is calibrated, but I figured as long as they matched on the meter it would be ok, and it seems to be.
I don't have a ton of noise gate experience, but its pretty meh at low gain and soft playing, atleast mine is. It sounds awkward even with a weak gate, perhaps I just need to play with it more. If you want to hammer out some super tight metal riffs its great though, so thats what I'll use mine for. Quick demo here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_JJtU06Ud-Y
I boxed mine in a 125B from tayda. Pictures here https://imgur.com/a/UlQ1O
Thanks for the layout Miro and for the suggestions Shaun Martin and Geiri.
just finished the MXR NG, using 2SK30A for the fet. It works. thnx for the layout.
ReplyDeleteHello, I have a question about the plate,
ReplyDeleteWhat are the squares with a red dot inside?
Thank you
Those are cuts in the copper tracks. Usually made with a small drill bit twisted by hand just a few times.
Deletethis layout verifit??
ReplyDeleteMine works great, been using it for years now, though it adds a bit of a fuzzy distortion to the signal if I don't have some sort of buffer in front of it. Works great in the effects loop or after an SHO with unity gain.
ReplyDeleteSeven years later... I traced the Tonepad schematic. Almost embarrassing to ask but shouldn't the 2.2M resistor at input go to ground. Hint - see the break on the ground rail strip 3 hidden under the 1uF capacitor?
ReplyDeleteIndeed! That 2.2M is connected to the ground just through the 1uF cap. It seems a mistake, pretty weird. The thing was already said in a comment above, but it was ignored.
DeleteIt should be easy move the 2.2M resistor from the input to the pin 4 of the IC stripe connecting it to the ground.
I never built it, but could the layout a bit messy with the impedance with this "mistake"?
Maybe is for this tertiumsquid1 need a buffer in front to make work it better.
Mine doesnt work at all! i replace the JFET transistor to a 5457 and doest nothing
DeleteMine works beautifully. If you are substituting transistors or op amps from those listed in parts list, you will need to make changes to resistors to maintain correct biasing. I cannot tell you what those will be. For the 2N5485 FET, you will need to make changes as stated in the red text at the beginning and carefully note orientation. For what it's worth, I used TL072 op amp and matched 2N5088 bjt.s. 2N3094 matched bjt's also worked but tone was not as warm. It still works with unmatched bjt's but the release oscillates. Make sure the 2.2M resistor is between input and ground. The stripboard layout is wrong.
ReplyDeleteWhy did I make it when the 3pdt on dug sounded. I have given an additional 1M R input to ground or output to ground but still. Can anyone help me?
Deleteanother observation:
ReplyDeletethe tonebad PCB and schematic do not match.
The PCB shows a 47p cap between pins 1 and 2 on the IC. This might help with oscillations if you experience them.
Why did I make it when the 3pdt on dug sounded. I have given an additional 1M R input to ground or output to ground but still. Can anyone help me?
ReplyDeleteAndré mention adding a send and return jacks to his build, but not much details on how... Can anyone explain how to do that?
ReplyDeleteThe layout is verified,. It works fine. I used a 2sk118 jfet. Jun. Rockin from Philippines. More power!!
ReplyDeleteThe modded version is verified. It works and i dont need to alter anything. Its the mbps that is wrong. It does not seem to fit wt the schem. Do it works. Greetings fro Philippines. Jun.
ReplyDeleteThe non polar 1mf cap in parallel with 100k res is supposed to be 10nf not 1mf guys.
ReplyDeleteIn my mxr NG ,, i changed 680ohms to 1.39 k and 1mf caps 2nd and 3rd row bottom right changed to .69 mf electro.jfet i used 2sk118, 2n3904 trans. NE5532 for op amps.
ReplyDeleteIt works guyz i hope it will help in any way.more power.
There's a mistake in the third row regarding ground. The 680r meets with the 2M2 input pulldown resistor ground leg and the 1uf cap. That's very wrong. The 1uf doesn't even fit in the layout. Take that into account. Cheers!
ReplyDeleteCan someone please confirm if this is working or not and to which schematics this one is bound to ?
ReplyDeleteBuilt this without suggested modifications but fixed the 2M2 resistor routing to ground. Works fine. No squealing or funny noises. I tested different low to high hfe matched 2n3904’s pairs. Didn’t notice much difference. I’ll test a bit more and I think this is going to be boxed.
ReplyDelete