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Thanks alex The only reverb brick three build on here is the rub a dub deluxe. Its not bad but i have made 3 of them for friends and i am hoping this one can be dialed down for subtle reverb. I have 4 more of these bricks to use. My friends here in st louis designed them. He gave me 6 brick 3 and 6 brick 2 . I still have several of each and cant wait to try another version of the brick 3. I made 4 dif versions for brick 2 and the best imo was the wampler Faux spring reverb it can be set to a very low amount of reverb. My friend that designed these said not to use anything but a 10k dual for the brick three but ill use the 100k dual as per madbean . Thanks Alex Ill start on this one this weekend cant wait to here it.
seriously doubt it. the bdtr 1 has six pinouts the bdtr3 has 10. They are talking about a brick four that will have a few more options besides. reverb .
they are abbreviations for the transistor and the voltage regulator. IGO is input ground output for the 78l05 voltage regulator. and the 2n5088 transistor CBE is collector base emitter
great layout. dirty visioins beat me too it. im glad i made it. i prefer this to the rub a dub deluxe. it can be mixed down further . the rub a dub deluxe does have more versitility but it doesnt get as mild this one is way better for my taste. Thank You Alex this is an awesome layout. the entire build took me about 2.5 hours including my enclosue
here is a pic of the ping i did . ill post a gut shot later tonight Alex. its oretty packed but perfect fit considering the soft latch take up a lot of room i stacked the two boards in front of the switch and the battery at the bottom. i love this build .
While waiting to buy a BTDR-3, I hooked up a medium BTDR-2.
Works fine, modulation doesn't get annoying until the verb pot is full on.
I agree with strassercaster, great reverb if looking for a more subtle verb.
If you want to hook up a brick-2, just leave connections for pins 7 thru 10 open. Of course the Room control should also be omitted as it will be hooked up to nothing with a brick-2.
It will be interesting to compare bricks once I get a brick-3, tough to tell with the video.
And I also have to agree, fantastic layout Alex! You've inspired me to re-work the Chasm Reverb layout in the forum.
But i've got oscillations past 11 o'clock on room settings... 100KB dual is too much i think. Belton datasheet say 10KB dual for room settings. I put 47K on every 100K of the dual pots, to get around 33K dual pot "home made". Good setting, no more oscillations, at maximum room.
I made two of these. The first works fine. The second works, but it has a sort of low oscillation that builds up in it. It's quiet at first, then it has a sort of low note (like a really echo-y 60 cycle hum that starts from nothing, then starts building up. You can stop it by zeroing the room pot, then it will start building again.
Any ideas on this? (Is this the same sort of oscillation that jack-vester was getting?)
replaced all the elecrolytics (in case it was PS buzz of some sort) - it didn't help. But it seems like it only really occurs above about noon on the pot, so it may be exactly what jack-vester was experiencing.
You could try reducing the 1u cap on the bottom right to something like 470n? That should cut some bass going into the brick and may stop the oscillation build up. Or reduce the dual pot to 10K (as per belton data sheet). I'd try the cap first
Thanks, Ciaran. I'll keep that idea in mind. I think I'm going to try tweaking the room pot first (only because it'll be more in line with the 10k the data sheet suggests, and it seems to have worked once). Good idea though, I'll try that if the pot trick doesn't work.
Well, putting a 47K across each of the dual gangs on the room pot DID eliminate the oscillation, but the price was eliminating some of the reverb range. As compared to my un-altered and working fine first model, the same settings yield much less "roominess" on the altered model. It may be that I can raise the parallel resistance up a bit toward 100K and get more back without oscillation. That'll be trial and error though.
I would be curious to know what causes this. These pot gangs are ONLY connected to the reverb brick, so I have to assume whatever is happening must be in there. Strange how one works fine and the other does not. Maybe slight variations in the internals? Maybe some were made with different internal values?
I ended up removing the 47K. It just took too much away from the reverb. For now I just need to remember to keep the room below noon to avoid oscillation. I may try rebuilding the circuit just to see if I get a different result.
One thing: The resistance across the pot is only about 4K7 when it's in circuit. So it must be in parallel with some lower resistance in the brick. The oscillation definitely seems to be related to the brick and room pot, rather than the outside circuit.
FYI: Altering the resistance of the dual gang worked, but it also lowered the amount of reverb considerably, so I decided that was not acceptable. Changing the cap as Ciaran suggested did nothing about the oscillation at all. Playing around with lead dress in the box did nothing either. As a final check, I took a good brick out of a good circuit and put the brick from this circuit in there. It oscillated. And the good brick in the questionable circuit, did not.
So it's the brick. No doubt about it, since the oscillation follows it.
Interesting detail: The good brick in the good pedal shows just a teeeeeensy hint at this behavior when you turn the verb and room all the way up. The oscillation sound is there, but it does not get louder and it only happens at the extreme. So my theory is that they all have this tendency to oscillate, and maybe they can all pass Belton's spec check without oscillating, but then how WE use them, SOME of them will oscillate, even if most won't, because of spec differences.
I'm seeing if I can exchange this bad brick. Thanks for the input and maybe my experience can be informative to someone else.
Just a quick update: A replacement brick worked perfectly in the circuit. So out of three bricks I've tried in this circuit, two worked fine, one oscillated in the upper half of the verb dial.
So my advice is that if you are getting oscillations in this circuit, don't try to work around it, see if you can exchange the brick. That seems to be where the variation is. I suspect they don't test these things with anything but a small verb pot - where they all work fine.
Just built one of these. Fired up just fine right off the bat. I haven’t boxed it yet so I ran it completely open to the elements for testing and there isn’t even a hint of noise, oscillations or any weird artefacts.
I’ll have to play around with the verb and room controls to figure out the best settings but from my brief test drive, it’s a nice addition.
Unfortunetly here it not going to well, I start selling my reverb pedal that I design and guess what, out of 10 I have 4 that oscillate, 3 low frequency and the fourth one high frequency oscillation. It really suuck cause the one that work well sound great but I can't sell the one that oscilate at all. so it's a real bummer, I'm looking into perhaps building my own brick using the schematic from the russian guys, but so far it is not working at all.
I'll typically wire the LED to the +9V circuit - when that closes, then the LED lights up.
Are there any benefits to doing it like this? And I assume the LED (which won't require a series resistor thanks to the onboard 4k7) just goes to ground?
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteThanks alex The only reverb brick three build on here is the rub a dub deluxe. Its not bad but i have made 3 of them for friends and i am hoping this one can be dialed down for subtle reverb. I have 4 more of these bricks to use. My friends here in st louis designed them. He gave me 6 brick 3 and 6 brick 2 . I still have several of each and cant wait to try another version of the brick 3. I made 4 dif versions for brick 2 and the best imo was the wampler Faux spring reverb it can be set to a very low amount of reverb. My friend that designed these said not to use anything but a 10k dual for the brick three but ill use the 100k dual as per madbean . Thanks Alex Ill start on this one this weekend cant wait to here it.
ReplyDeleteOh ya I love the layout it will make mounting a breeze not to mention save a ton of offboard wiring GREAT JOB!
DeleteI agree! Best Belton brick stripboard layout EVER!!!
DeleteThanks guys!
DeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteI have a BTDR-1H can i mod this to work with my Brick?
ReplyDeleteseriously doubt it. the bdtr 1 has six pinouts the bdtr3 has 10. They are talking about a brick four that will have a few more options besides. reverb .
DeleteThank you strassercaster i see now why it wont work.
Deletethere is a bdtr1 layout on sabrotone I believe
DeleteWhat is the OGI and CBE?
ReplyDeletethey are abbreviations for the transistor and the voltage regulator. IGO is input ground output for the 78l05 voltage regulator. and the 2n5088 transistor CBE is collector base emitter
DeleteOk, thanks for you replie!
Deleteverified....this is a fantastic reverb. Super tidy layout Alex. Thanks again.
ReplyDeleteThanks for verifying it!
ReplyDeleteNo prob Thanks for the absolutely perfect layout....
Deletegreat layout. dirty visioins beat me too it. im glad i made it. i prefer this to the rub a dub deluxe. it can be mixed down further . the rub a dub deluxe does have more versitility but it doesnt get as mild this one is way better for my taste. Thank You Alex this is an awesome layout. the entire build took me about 2.5 hours including my enclosue
ReplyDeleteWell done!
DeleteI'm glad it works.
What size of box did you use?
http://tagboardeffects.blogspot.com/p/forum.html
ReplyDeletehere is a pic of the ping i did . ill post a gut shot later tonight Alex. its oretty packed but perfect fit considering the soft latch take up a lot of room i stacked the two boards in front of the switch and the battery at the bottom. i love this build .
While waiting to buy a BTDR-3, I hooked up a medium BTDR-2.
ReplyDeleteWorks fine, modulation doesn't get annoying until the verb pot is full on.
I agree with strassercaster, great reverb if looking for a more subtle verb.
If you want to hook up a brick-2, just leave connections for pins 7 thru 10 open. Of course the Room control should also be omitted as it will be hooked up to nothing with a brick-2.
It will be interesting to compare bricks once I get a brick-3, tough to tell with the video.
And I also have to agree, fantastic layout Alex! You've inspired me to re-work the Chasm Reverb layout in the forum.
Done!!
DeleteBut i've got oscillations past 11 o'clock on room settings...
100KB dual is too much i think.
Belton datasheet say 10KB dual for room settings.
I put 47K on every 100K of the dual pots, to get around 33K dual pot "home made". Good setting, no more oscillations, at maximum room.
I made two of these. The first works fine. The second works, but it has a sort of low oscillation that builds up in it. It's quiet at first, then it has a sort of low note (like a really echo-y 60 cycle hum that starts from nothing, then starts building up. You can stop it by zeroing the room pot, then it will start building again.
ReplyDeleteAny ideas on this? (Is this the same sort of oscillation that jack-vester was getting?)
replaced all the elecrolytics (in case it was PS buzz of some sort) - it didn't help. But it seems like it only really occurs above about noon on the pot, so it may be exactly what jack-vester was experiencing.
DeleteYou could try reducing the 1u cap on the bottom right to something like 470n? That should cut some bass going into the brick and may stop the oscillation build up. Or reduce the dual pot to 10K (as per belton data sheet). I'd try the cap first
DeleteThanks, Ciaran. I'll keep that idea in mind. I think I'm going to try tweaking the room pot first (only because it'll be more in line with the 10k the data sheet suggests, and it seems to have worked once). Good idea though, I'll try that if the pot trick doesn't work.
DeleteWell, putting a 47K across each of the dual gangs on the room pot DID eliminate the oscillation, but the price was eliminating some of the reverb range. As compared to my un-altered and working fine first model, the same settings yield much less "roominess" on the altered model. It may be that I can raise the parallel resistance up a bit toward 100K and get more back without oscillation. That'll be trial and error though.
DeleteI would be curious to know what causes this. These pot gangs are ONLY connected to the reverb brick, so I have to assume whatever is happening must be in there. Strange how one works fine and the other does not. Maybe slight variations in the internals? Maybe some were made with different internal values?
I ended up removing the 47K. It just took too much away from the reverb. For now I just need to remember to keep the room below noon to avoid oscillation. I may try rebuilding the circuit just to see if I get a different result.
DeleteOne thing: The resistance across the pot is only about 4K7 when it's in circuit. So it must be in parallel with some lower resistance in the brick. The oscillation definitely seems to be related to the brick and room pot, rather than the outside circuit.
FYI: Altering the resistance of the dual gang worked, but it also lowered the amount of reverb considerably, so I decided that was not acceptable. Changing the cap as Ciaran suggested did nothing about the oscillation at all. Playing around with lead dress in the box did nothing either. As a final check, I took a good brick out of a good circuit and put the brick from this circuit in there. It oscillated. And the good brick in the questionable circuit, did not.
ReplyDeleteSo it's the brick. No doubt about it, since the oscillation follows it.
Interesting detail: The good brick in the good pedal shows just a teeeeeensy hint at this behavior when you turn the verb and room all the way up. The oscillation sound is there, but it does not get louder and it only happens at the extreme. So my theory is that they all have this tendency to oscillate, and maybe they can all pass Belton's spec check without oscillating, but then how WE use them, SOME of them will oscillate, even if most won't, because of spec differences.
I'm seeing if I can exchange this bad brick. Thanks for the input and maybe my experience can be informative to someone else.
Just a quick update: A replacement brick worked perfectly in the circuit. So out of three bricks I've tried in this circuit, two worked fine, one oscillated in the upper half of the verb dial.
DeleteSo my advice is that if you are getting oscillations in this circuit, don't try to work around it, see if you can exchange the brick. That seems to be where the variation is. I suspect they don't test these things with anything but a small verb pot - where they all work fine.
Just built one of these. Fired up just fine right off the bat. I haven’t boxed it yet so I ran it completely open to the elements for testing and there isn’t even a hint of noise, oscillations or any weird artefacts.
ReplyDeleteI’ll have to play around with the verb and room controls to figure out the best settings but from my brief test drive, it’s a nice addition.
Nice layout! Thanks for putting this one out.
Unfortunetly here it not going to well, I start selling my reverb pedal that I design and guess what, out of 10 I have 4 that oscillate, 3 low frequency and the fourth one high frequency oscillation. It really suuck cause the one that work well sound great but I can't sell the one that oscilate at all. so it's a real bummer, I'm looking into perhaps building my own brick using the schematic from the russian guys, but so far it is not working at all.
ReplyDeleteI'm a bit of an amateur - confused by the LED+.
ReplyDeleteI'm assuming this goes to my I/O LED?
I'll typically wire the LED to the +9V circuit - when that closes, then the LED lights up.
Are there any benefits to doing it like this? And I assume the LED (which won't require a series resistor thanks to the onboard 4k7) just goes to ground?
Thanks!
The layout includes the 4k7 current limiting resistor, so the LED+ connects directly to your on/off led Anode (+).
DeleteIts just an easier way to do it rather than having to do it all offboard connecting from the power socket to the LED.
This comment has been removed by the author.
Delete