One of our members (Kornel) was given the schematic by Dan from 4ms and he asked me to draw a layout for it.
I don't have permission to publish the schematic but the layout matches it.
Please do not ask for it.
Monday, 20 August 2018
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ReplyDeleteThanks Alex!
ReplyDeleteWow, 12 pots and 6 switches, that's going to be a wiring nightmare. Probably still give it a go as it sounds quite interesting. Awesome layout as always, cheers Alex.
ReplyDeleteI'm also on the project, just checking the BOM to order the missing parts. Luckily, I have components for 1-2 Swash Mini, so I can use most of them in this.
DeleteI'm thinking about having a Depth control for the LFO, maybe a 50K pot or sg?
And yeah, wiring will be 'fun', 'bout 10 meters will be needed I'm afraid ;-)
For this, I think a 1590XX, or even better, a 1590DD box will be necessary...
Thanks!!!!!!!!!!
ReplyDeleteI think, there is a small error, but I'm not sure. And it's not a big thing. For me, it seems that pin 4 and 6 of Tame/Trouble switch (Sw2) is replaced. (or pin 1 and 3, doesn't matter)
ReplyDeleteWhy? Because Trouble is the old way, when TL062's pin 2 through the 1K res is grounded through the 10u cap. And in this case the power goes directly from DC to the circuit. So pin 6 (trouble) must be in pair with +9V (this was the case in Swash Mini).
In Tame mode, the circuit only gets power if the stomp switch is on, so through it. So pin 4's pair is pin 8 of Stomp switch (Sw5). Is it clear this way?
I think it's logical, and also, on the schematics I see it this way, too.
(I meant the pinout numbering this way: http://www.tdpri.com/attachments/switches2_diag_4-jpg.206966/ )
Verified, but I ended up making a few changes.
ReplyDeleteI changed Speed1 to Speed3 as the LFO was fast at 0 and slow turned up to 10.
Also changed Low3 to Low1 as I prefer full power at 0 and fully starved power at 10.
I'm not sure how the original controls are wired so changing this stuff was just a personal preference.
I also used a 3PDT stomp switch for self oscillation, so I installed an extra LED to show if the switch is engaged.
Thanks !
I'm very glad to hear that! I'm just before boxing, the board, pots, wires are done.
DeleteYes, these are just a matter of taste, we are different, I mean the LFO is obvious, but the Low Power does not feel the same for everyone.
On the schematics there is no numbering on the pots, so it's not always clear.
The Low Power is interesting: in all versions, it's clearly wired to 2-3. But my friend, whom I made a Swash Mini also would prefer your version. He said many times, that he thinks that I made it wrong. But I didn't. It's just a different logic. Originally at 4ms they figured out it this way.
And what do You think about my Tame/Trouble comment? In Tame, it must be completely silent if it's bypassed, but in Trouble, even in bypass mode there can be some noise. On the vero layout, I felt that Sw2-6 and 4 are replaced. Have You tried it?
The LED for the Self Osc is a good idea, I also used it in the mini. Although a 3PDT switch is a bit luxury for me, a cheaper DPDT with 6 pins enough for this job ;-)
Congratulation, well done, nice job!
Thanks for the verification, now I'm super excited to finish mine.
Hi Kornel,
ReplyDeleteI built a drone synth a few years ago and the low power was wired 1-2 so I was already used to it that way.
I haven't tried your changes to the tame / trouble switch yet. It's something I hope to have a play around with soon. For now I'm enjoying the absolute chaos this pedal creates.
DPDT or DPST is plenty, but I only had DPDT toggle or 3PDT stomp. I really wanted a stomp for the self oscillation.
Have you put a depth control for the LFO in your build?
Good luck with the boxing and thanks for you work on this pedal. It's super awesome.
Regards,
Detrital
(p.s. forgot to log in last post...)
Cheers,
ReplyDeleteyes, I plan to put in a B100k for depth control. And it has to be wired backward, I mean to pin 2 and 3. Somewhere around SW6, before or after, I'll see. It's a must I think.
I'm a synth guy, and I was wondering about a CV in/out too. But as I'm not an expert, after killing a
- earphone
- a cheap car radio
- and possibly my synth's LFO
with a test version of a Swash Mini, I dropped the idea ;-)
I'm a maximalist, but this beast with 13 pots and the other stuff, is already awesome.
The thanks goes to Alex, the bigger part was his in this job, I just acquired the schematics, and discussed it with him.
Regards,
Kornel
Awesome, Can you please post the mod instructions for the LFO depth control once you've got it working?
ReplyDeleteI've modded the tame / trouble and got rid of the noise in bypass too. I disconnected Sw2-1 from 9V and connected it to Sw2-3 (or Sw5-8). Thanks for the info on that.
Thanks to Alex for the layout.
I'm having so much fun with this pedal.
Sure, it was my intention to notify the community about the LFO depth option.
DeleteI think your solution will be good: the point is, that in Tame mode it must be grounded through the 10nF cap, and in Trouble mode through the 10uF one. So it's not just about the noise in bypass mode, but also in wet mode, this results in a slightly different sound.
I'm very curious about it, because in the original, Mini version there is the 10uf cap, so I can't wait to hear the sound with the 10nF one.
Yes, thing thing is so much fun, I'm getting out every day something new from it!
As You can see, I've posted some informations on the LFO depth. For me, a 1M linear one worked well.
DeleteBut can You verify, that the EQ pots aren't doing quite much, especially the Treble, which only has a very subtle, almost unnoticable effect. When I start to turn the Treble pot, it does somthing at the end and at the beginning of the pot turn, but in between, almost nothing can bea heard.
I've triple checked the schematics, and it's seems ok.
Fantastic! Thanks Kornel.
DeleteI'm going to try the LFO mod today. I only have a B100k pot though, so I'm going to experiment with connecting pin1 to ground and see how that goes.
I can verify that the bass and treble pots don't do a lot. They tend to have an effect on what the bass and treble noise is doing - rather than boosting or cutting the bass and treble frequencies.
Hi!
DeleteThanks for the feedback. Now I'm satisfied with my work, so the error is not in me. On their site they don't even mention the Treble, and in this video, it's obvious, that they do almost nothing ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sp0mjGSvOgY , he starts to turn the treble at 2:20, and later the bass too, but seeing that not much happens, he gave it up ).
It's not a problem however, even this way, it's an instant and endless fun. And I noticed, that the bass do a lot in most cases, it coulours the tone very well, and even in some settings the treble adds a bit too.
On the LFO Speed: the 100k is good, as it is in the layout, and the schematics. With that, the LFO goes down to as low as 0,2HZ, but with it at the higher freqs it's harder to control, because You have to turn too small amounts and You are imidiately in the 100hz territory. I also tried 10k; it was even better at the highs, but the bottom went faster to about 2hz. The best for me was a 50k.
And the LFO Depth: yes, You have to experiment with it. The highest I had was a 1M, but a 2 M can be even better. And it's not a problem to me, that it doesn't diminish completely: turn off the LFO at the bottom.
Another thing: You mentioned a drone synth earlier. Can I as what it was? I just started to get in this thing, and I'm super excited about anything. Now my next big project will be 'Benjolin', although I will have to make a Vero layout from the schematics myself... but maybe, from Alex's layouts I've learned that much, so it won't be impossible.
Hi Kornel, I used the swash at rehearsal last night and got a bit more response from the bass control. It's interesting how everything can react very differently when you make a few small changes. Must have been the settings I had before. I usually just leave the bass and treble at max.
DeleteI finished the depth mod for the LFO, I used a B100k and found it worked best with Pin1 connected to ground. Pin3 is wired to SW6-5 on the board and Pin2 goes to SW6-5 on the switch (same as your LFO mod). With the pot CCW the LFO disappears completely in all settings. I just need to get a B10k for the noise volume and it's pretty much finished.
The drone synth I built was based on the Peyote Hetrodyne Space Explorer from Beavis Audio. It has 3 square wave oscillators and another oscillator to drive an 8 step sequencer / waveform generator. I ended up doing a few mods, changed a lot of component values and didn't put the white noise generator in. I also added a DI and built it on a rack mount panel. It makes some lovely nasty square waves and works using additive synthesis. I have a schematic and PCB's if you're interested?
The benjolin look really cool. If I had something with CV out I would be very interested in building one and getting into the modular synth stuff. Maybe one day...
Cheers,
Detrital
Hi, the bass is absolutely responsive, I use it frequently for modulating/colouring the sound.
DeleteAnd yes, everything interacts with everything: with a little change of sg, the sound gets drastically different.
I will try grounding the pin1, so are You sure, that in any settings it clears completely the LFO signal? Sounds good. Then maybe the 1M is not even necessary.
And the 10k pot for noise is a must, because the Mini was a loud beast, and this one peaks at about -20dB on maximum volume.
I'm absolutely interested in that drone synth: sounds a bit more musical, and ineresting because of the step sequencer. I found, that Alex made a Vero layout for it, too.
When You said PCB's, how do You mean? You have PCB plans? You make PCBs yourself? That's my next plan, although I love vero.
Hi.
DeleteWith the settings I've tried so far it completely clears it. The LFO LED also turns off with it CCW.
I'll put a B10k in as soon as I can get one. I've found the noise isn't loud enough compared to the clean input.
I drew the PCB files and got some dual layer boards professionally manufactured. I only used 1 board so I still have a couple left over. I can post you one if you want? Or email you the schematic if you want to build your own board? I did quite a few mods so there are more switches and parts on my synth than the standard space explorer. You might need to do a new layout on vero.
Some of the mods were; voltage starve, 3x "dive bomb" caps, on/off for each oscillator, diode or resistor mixing for each channel, switchable PSU filtering, resistors to stop the inverter output shorting to input in with pots CW, DI with ground lift. I also used 10 turn pots for each frequency, messed with the frequency ranges a bit and put some spare pads on the board for any future mods.
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DeleteHot damn fellas! I am going to get after this, built a Mini and love it, so why not!
ReplyDeleteYes please share the information on the LFO depth mod, I love having a depth control on such a thing. Since the schematic isn't available It might be rather difficult to try and trace the LFO out to see what's happening.
Thanks guys, Thanks Alex!
Hi,
Deletethe schematics doesn't contain information about the depth control. But it's not a big deal: build the whole, but don't wire the LFO switch. Somewhere around, maybe preferably after it, but before You wire it to the board at Sw 6-5 put in a pot like a B100K for example. Maybe it's the best way to test it on a breadboard. Don't solder the connections around the LFO switch and depth pot, try them first on a breadboard. I think the depth pot must be wired backward, so the wire from Sw6's pin6 must be connected to pin3 of the depth pot, and from it's pin2 go to the board's Sw6-5 point.
But I'll have to try it first, I plan to do this way.
What we are doing is to cut the LFO signal's route, before it goes to the Treble section, and insert a pot there.
So can we call this verified? Thanks!
ReplyDeleteHi,
Deletedetrital fragments already made a working one, and I'm about to finish mine this weekend, just the boxing left to do. I'll check back if it's done, and will share the informations about the LFO depth control pot type, too.
Kornel
Yesterday finsihed mine, we can call it verified. The mentioned 2 errors needs to be fixed (LFO Speed 1 -> 3, Sw2-4 <-> Sw-6). I will notify Alex about these.
DeleteDon't be fooled by the subtle effect of treble; I thought it was not working but it is.
Now I'm working on a few more mods for it: LFO Depth, LFO tri/square switch, and LFO target switch. If I'm gonna be successful, then I come back with the details. Cheers
Cool! Those have been swapped.
DeleteYesterday I was experimenting with the LFO Depth pot. I found that the best is a 1M linear one.
ReplyDeleteBut consider, that even with it, at fully CCW position the LFO signal doesn't diminish completely. In some settings it does, but sometimes not. Although it's still a good plus modulation source for the pedal, and it requires only one more potentiometer, so it's a worthwhile effort.
The way of installing it is to cut the wire which goes to the Sw6 LFO switch after the 'Sw6-5' point, and insert the pot there. The one wire part which comes from the switch goes to leg 2 of the pot, and from leg 3 solder the another to the board's 'Sw6-5' point.
The other mentioned mods were skipped for the time being, maybe in the future I will do more experiment, and try again.
One another idea is, if You are an experimentalist noise addict guy, to duplicate this awesome simple LFO circuit, because the LFO is a huge addition to this pedal (then of course You wire it to the pedal separately; don't use the jumper from Sw6-5). You can wire the second one to a different point, like Swash, or Gate, and it's also possible to get a square wave out of IC4558's pin 1, and make the LFO wave shape selectable with a DPDT 'On-off-on' switch, which then replaces the normal one in this layout.
Sorry guys, we found another problem. Although, as a whole it's verified, and working, but is's too silent. And it's because the Noise Volume potentiometer (which is practically responsible for the loudness of the effect itself) is erroneously occur on Alex's layout as a 100k linear potentiometer, although on the schematics it's a 10k one. I checked it again, because at maximum volume the signal comes out at a -20 - -25 dB value.
ReplyDeleteI have acquired a not too well readable schematics from Dan Green, and I also compared it to this vero layut, but can You believe? Both of us overlooked it.
My apologies for the caused problems! Replace it with a 10k one, or if You haven't started it yet, build in that kind.
Best regards,
Kornel
Changed!
DeleteThanks!
DeleteI hope it was the last one...
Dope! I'm starting my build today. I got an extra 10k.. having built the mini swash, it's loud AF.. I put a trim pot inside, I'll probably try an A10k in this one
DeleteIn regards to your depth pot add, did you try a B2M? I have a bunch from something so it might just need a little more resistance to squash the LFO signal.
Yes, with the brute Mini, I destroyed an earphone, and a car radio ;-)
DeleteNo, I didn't try with a 2M pot, because I don't have, and it's kinda rare in common shops.
I urge You to try it out, because I'm curios about the result. And do me a favor: check the tone pots, especially the treble: I hardly hear any change in the sound turning them.
Yes, I also checked the Mini now: it goes easily in the red zone above 0 dB!
DeleteThis one, even with the 10k noise pot, not. And just plugging in some input with 0 db, the clean signal, without any noise already drops. And wven with noise, all maxed out, the peak never goes above -7 dB.
The problem is around the master pot: there are too many resistors (in the mini there was just one), and even, maybe the master completely unnecessary (or has to be changed to a 10k?). Why anyway? We have already 2 colume pots, the clean and the noise.
And because of this, the Standard is much more milder, and harder to drive to self oscillations.
If someone of You started to build it, but haven't boxed it yet: experiment please with the volume output, and let's find some solution for that problem.
More of us finished this, and stated, that the treeble doesn't do too much, don't worry about that. Her, in this video, at 0:53 You can see, that in that settnigs specifically nothing happens:
ReplyDeletehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lh9gr65QPEs
(the Bass is also not realy what You would expect from it - check at 0:45 - , but look: what is predictable on this pedal anyway?!)
It's a strange way for a pot to be hooked up.. a 10k across 2 and 3, and then a 1k across 1 and 2.. does it work more noticeably with the post clip On?
DeleteYes it is exactly that way in the schematics, as on Alex's layout. It is a common filter circuit. But maybe it's just filtering the noise? Which is funny, because it's a 'noise' pedal.
DeleteI don't have the rights to share the schematics, but I can show You a little piece from. ( https://drive.google.com/open?id=1MV15PQf5uDyItTOXRJy0mFU8XTATeghM )On this part, You can see the whole tone section. The signal comes from TL062's pin 7, through that 1uF electro, and goes toward the TL072's pin 2, from Treble 2, through a 100nF and a 10K (and also the postclip is there). Please, this is maybe the only problematic part, check again, if it's correct, although in the videos it's obvious that we can't expect much of it (I mean the treble).
It's not that easy on this pedal, to state something, like it's better with postclip, or sg. Everything here interacts with everything. So there are some settings, when it's noticable, but even then, it's not much.
On that wire on the upper right comes from the LFO.
DeleteSo its blending between 2 filters if I'm looking at that correctly, just for the hell of it I'd socket that 10n and try like.. a 1n and see if that has a dramatic effect. Usually one order of magnitude doesn't have a ton of change in a cap blend scenario. I built the box for mine first (makes it harder to give up on a project) so I will be building the board this week.
DeleteIf You go easy with it, the Swash can be very musical in it's own way ;-)
ReplyDeletehttps://soundcloud.com/alizon_device/swashmax003?in=alizon_device/sets/noise-swash-max-by-alizon
(no input, just a bit of reverb+delay)
Also.. would a CV in work where the jumper from the LFO switch to the 10n Is? Wire a stereo jack that connects that jumper when nothing is plugged in, and disconnects the LFO when it's plugged in?
ReplyDeleteAbsolutely. I wanted to do it, but there was no time, later, maybe. Check this out, it's the eurorack version: the CV goes in the exactly same place there, and there's another CV, with vactrols, which goes to the swash/gate:
Deletehttps://4mscompany.com/swash/modular/schematic800.pdf
See my post above about the 10n in the treble control too ;) I am planning on doing this hopefully this week. I'm having to work late this week so we will see. Definitely doing the CV. I have enough room in my enclosure!
DeleteI saw that too, can't wait to see the result! Any mods appreciated!
DeleteAfter changing the Noise volume pot to 10k, it got better a bit, went up to around -10 dB. But it's still not enough.
ReplyDeleteAny ideas getting it more louder? If the layout is correct, what can we do? To change some of the resistors at the end of the signal chain? Tips someone?
The final signal comes from TL072's pin 7, through the 1 uF cap, and a 1k, a 47k, and another 1k resistor. Do I experiment with it? Which one to replace, and what is the suggested value, a higher one, like a 100k instead of the 47k?
So noise is the gain resistor for that final output stage, and then it goes to the master .. the 47k definitely snubs the signal there, but it's also a mixing resistor from the clean signal opamp stage too.. I would think a b100k for noise makes sense as the higher the resistance there the louder and more distorted that gain stage gets. Is that bass 100r to ground correct? That seems like it would dump a lot of signal... I'm no EE..
DeleteLooking at the Eurorack and mini swash, they all share the same basic opamp stages .. I have my board built finally but I'm just having a hard time getting time to finish it this week. I'll try and get it wired soon.
After a little more digging this is pretty much a values modified version of the "James tone stack" .. a couple analyses of this arrangement are easily found and show some options. I suspect that this may be the portion of the circuit killing the volume. I may get mine built today so I'll check back :)
DeleteI'm also not an expert, but there is a 100R on the schematics I got from Dan.
DeleteAlthough, we can experiment with it, as with the capacitor grounding the treble.
Yes, all versions' basics are the same, just minor changes were made to them ( here You can find lots of useful, historical infos, mods : http://www.commonsound.com/kits/doku.php?id=commonsound:swash ).
In this standard version, maybe they did too much for making it even more tamed, I think.
About the James thing: You are absolutely correct, brilliant find! I would be glad to hear about the experiments, because mine is boxed, and I don't want to ruin it with in and out soldering etc.
So, hurry! And please, if You can, check the signal output, with dB meter. We did it with Detritial, and it's low. Because it's not easy to get sound out of it, the simpliest way is to plug sg in the input at 0dB, and if you turn on the swash, the volume will drop (turn down the noise volume, and master, clean all the way up)
I would be very happy and satisfied, if we could make this better! Although this beast is still a lot of fun! Good luck wit hit!
Anyway, it's a wonderful literature about the Tone stack You found! ( https://www.ampbooks.com/mobile/amp-technology/james-tonestack-analysis/ )
DeleteEven You can find examples there, too.
For first, maybe it would be the easiest and most simple method to completely bypass the tone section. After the 1 uF electro at TL062 out and preclip, jump directly to the 10k or 100nF before the input of TL062 with a jumper. This way we'll see, if the tones are doing something or not.
I'm not sure that they are responsible of the volume drop, because even the clean signal's volume drops without the noise section, but the clean voice doesn't go through the tones
Don't have a DB meter sorry. So I traced the layout over the CV swash schematic, and there's only a few small changes, mainly the tone stack and then the final output stage and clean blend. C9 on the Eurorack is a 1uf, and on this layout it's only 100n. This is the cap out of the tone stack into the post gain stage, maybe it's limiting ? The mini has a 1uf here too .. I will experiment with this value on mine this week. Also the self oscillation on the Eurorack version is fed back to input after the master volume circuit, though I don't think this would affect overall output, same in the mini. Swash 1 and 2 are swapped vs the Eurorack version and mini as well just for the sake of having similar operation.
DeleteI also think the noise pot should have a 10k in series with it, turned all the way down it's a short and it will kill volume completely. All the other gain stages have a 10k in series.
Still tweaking.
I should also add that I have been looking at how other circuits implement clean blends (mainly the Small sound big sound team awesome) and they use 470r mixing resistor, as well as a phase change toggle. I wonder if the phase is cutting some volume. Clean works on mine it's just not very loud like you said. I socketed the mixing resistors so I'll try 470
DeletedB meter: ableton live etc.
DeleteThe n cap is a good observation, maybe it worth a try to change to 1 uF.
The self osc place doesn't affect the overall output, but the quality of the self osc is different.
The swash 1-2 replacement is not important imho.
Noise pot + 10k res: dunno, give it a try maybe.
Thanks for trying the mixing resistors. Maybe it's not the problem, but we can improve it that way: but as Detritial suggested: they ( I mean the 2 mixing res 47k) must be the same value.
Well I got it all working finally. I put that 1u in there at C9.. and used standard values on the tone stack. I tried 470r in the mixing and it was no good, no signal definition. The 4.7k seemed ok. I'll try it with the 47k and see .. I'll concede the noise pot does seem like a 10k might be best.
DeleteMines loud AF. I don't have any means of measuring db as I said.
At this point I just have to try the 47k mixing and then see what I want to do with the LDR and CV input :)
Yeah, sounds good news, although it would be good to know exactly the output.
DeleteSo the cap before the TL072 is a 1uF, and what about the polarity? Positive towards the IC?
Is there no way to plug it in a computer? Even a sound card has a dB meter...
DeleteI used a monolithic 1u, the schematic for the Eurorack shows polarity if you don't have any non polarized.
DeleteI can try to find some cords and shit to plug it into the mic jack on my old desktop.
I think I'm going to use a C100k for speed on the LFO and try detritals
-- method for depth. The B2M works ok.. but it's not great.
DeleteOk, nevermind, if it's so difficult...
DeleteWith the mixing resistors also try 33k, or about 22k at the lowest. They help to prevent the signal bleeding back into the other op amp inputs via the negative feedback loop. Lowering their value below 47k should boost the output.
DeleteSome other mods to try for boosting the output level;
Remove the 1k after the 1uF on the TL072 noise output, and connecting the 1uF directly to the 47k like the clean channel.
The schematic says it's optional.
Remove the 1M. It's not on the schematic either. Again check if it makes any difference.
Remove the 1k between Master2 and Sw5-6, and install a link there instead.
I've also tried replacing the TL072 with a 4558. I got more output level but it lost a lot of the bass and made the sound of the swash quite different.
Yeah I tried a TL082 and it wasn't as good. I liked the sound with 4.7k mixing resistors but it certainly is wild. I will try the higher values. Haven't had any time
DeleteJust to make it clear: the schematic detritial mentioned is this: http://commonsound.com/swash/swashscheme.pdf It's an old, obsolete one. What I have, based on the informations from Dann Green, is the real Standard Swash (although it's not written on it). And so the layout of Alex based on mine, not on this. We now just want to figure it out, how could we raise it's volume. And yet, none of us know how a real one sounds, I mean how loud it is. Maybe it was intentional to tame the swash more.
ReplyDeleteIf You want a loud beast, then maybe it's easier to make a Swash Mini (here You can find a perfect one from Alex), and get the LFO out of the Standard vero layout, and add to it. And the Tame mod, if the noise disturbs You in bypass mode. Maybe this whole mixing section is not so important: it's better to do the mixing outside. I mean, to have a clean signal separately, and another into the Swash, and after mixing them outside together back.
Because the Mini is insanely loud, so loud, that You have to take care of it, because it goes to red easily. And sounds a bit more agressive that this.
But if You are brave and experimental enough, try those things detritial mentioned, like removing the 1ks, maybe the 1m, and to play with the mixing 47k resistors.
And if someone have an approved design change (I mean with checked loudness dB), please share it with us!
As alwasy, here You can find useful, interesting historical mods, and informations about the Swashes: http://www.commonsound.com/kits/doku.php?id=commonsound:swash, and here, amongst the tons of wonderful custom paint images, there are a few official demos, so You can hear, we are very close to that sound: https://4mscompany.com/swash/ (search for mp3, and wav)
I put in 1N4002s instead of mixing resistors, that's pretty cool. I used a b20k for Noise, seems to be the best, and then I used a b100k as detrtital indicated, with 1 to ground and 2 and 3 in the LFO out path. Got some LDRs paralleled up to swash and gate, and have them set up with built in LED so a 0-5v CV van drive them. Overall volumewise.. not as loud as the mini, but loud enough. I don't have an 1/8th inch cable to plug it into my computer so actual decibel readings I do not know. I'd certainly recommend trying the diode mixing.. I may put it on a switch like Detrital did.
ReplyDeleteSweet,bro! Tons of new additions, you are not joking, but doing it seriously ;-) . Can you tell a bit more bout the cv? Cause I also have ldrs and white leds home. And what about the eq? Is it better? Do the bass and treble do something?
DeleteAnyway, I love mine better and better, every day. Lots of fun, I can get lost for hours in it. Of course, the mini is louder and more direct and easier to use, but now, aftet a few weeks using the big one, I think that it's much more limited. If you give it some time, you will not regret it. You have to treat it very carefully, with very smooth moves, after you found some sweet sounds or rhythms. Even the clean pot shapes the sound because of the backbleeding. The cv control would be nice, cause then some tempo control would be possible, and that is cool, if you use it in some setup, and record a track.
Well I used some LDRs that are like 250k dark with one leg hooked up to the wires at the pots, lowering the value only slightly while dark, but they go really low resistance with light. So I set up a 78l05 and ran 5V to my breadboard and tested current limiting resistors with my pink LEDs and LDRs rolled in some heat shrink, ended up with 220R and still getting nearly full brightness at 5V (lowering the swash or gate resistance to nearly zero). Put them on a on/off/on toggle, probably could have used a single LED, but they are cheap. I also added a momentary kill switch on the out wire so I can stutter it and make choppy samples.
DeleteThe EQ.. Well it's like this .. the pedal has some "normal" sounding settings and these really show that the tone stack does in fact work. That being said, 99% of the time the device is not operating there so the treble knob seems nearly useless. The bass knob definitely will change the pitch of howling feedback etc.
I have some pics of my build so far at I Love Fuzz in the DIY section.
I actually used 1N5817's as the mixing diodes, they have like 240mv Fv making them superior to 1N4002 which is like 650. I put them on a toggle and tested some resistor values there, ended up with 33k. They are definitely different.. the diodes are very crisp as there is no bleed through and the clean sounds much cleaner. The 33k is a little muddied but in a good way and the clean acts kind of bananas not really clean. It was as simple as another hole and a 75 cent toggle since I had it all socketed so why not?! :)
I think Kornels earlier post about the tame switch is correct. When the toggle is selecting the 10uf the power should be on and bleeding even with the effect bypassed.. I set mine up this way.
Oh! I also switched the speed LFO pot to a C50K.. it still gets pretty slow and has a much nicer taper through the speed range, and still tops out at that angry swarm of bees buzz. Highly recommend the C taper here.
I guess at this point I'm considering mine done. I just need to finish boxing it. I will probably do a final build report on my I Love Fuzz thread.
Thanks guys for this build and all the fun I've had building and tweaking it.
An idea if You also find it too silent: put in a booster board, like this one, which is very small (9 X 7), and has a trimmer, so You can set a default desired output volume in the box:
ReplyDeletehttps://tagboardeffects.blogspot.com/2013/01/electro-harmonix-lpb1-with-trimmer.html
I prefer the Jack Orman mosfet boost. It requires a C5k though, I usually keep 5 or so on hand for these. The thought had crossed my mind, but I think it's going to be good. I may still mess with the oscillation point coming before the volume vs after the volume.. I think this particular device could be tweaked for eternity.
DeleteOne more optional thing: You can use a 1k instead of the 10k for the Gate, if You frequently use its opening.
ReplyDeleteFrom 4ms:
"Noisegait could be a 10k, as it’s written on the board, but builders often use a 1k. Either will work: 10k will give more sounds, but most of the cool stuff is in the 1k range."
I swapped it to 1k, and it's definitely more usable, more subtle changes are possible.
Maybe an A10k Is in order there you get most of the good stuff on the long sweep of the pot and still have some of the high end.. dammit .. more mods ;)
DeleteAlthough it's verified, all of You be advised, that it's a version, which is not so loud (peaks at -8dB), and the Treble/Bass don't do much (as I mentioned before, in lots of Youtube videos can be seen, that some of the official ones have the same behavior).
ReplyDeleteAfter a bit of exploreation, I'm sure, that this layout is based on the 'Swash 2.2' (old version): http://commonsound.com/swash/pcb22/bigdiagram.pdf
Sadly, not the latest, the Swash Max Tweaker.
Maybe it's easier to mod your existing Mini: cut the LFO from here, and insert into your Mini, with switches or jacks and patch cables. I tested it on mine, and the LFO works well with the Tone section. On Alex's Mini layout, wire the LFO into Tone 2 and/or 3, and the stripe above Tone 2. These 3 point modulate the sound completely differently by the LFO. This way You can make more exciting Your Swash Mini.
But if You think, it worth it to try to build this, check out before some of my demost I made with mine, to know what we're dealing with: https://soundcloud.com/alizon_device/sets/noise-swash-max-by-alizon
Hey!
DeleteI'm finally assembling mine, where's status led- in your schematics? I think is missing. I usually do CLR led > led- and le+ > +9v.
But you have 9+ already on the 3pdt bypass switch.
Let me know, thanks.
Hey,
Deletegreat to hear that! I'm curious about the result.
So, it's kinda crowded the wiring, isn't it, eh? ;-)
As on the layout it's written, but You have to read it carefully: You have to solder two wires to SW5-8: the Tame/Trouble switch (SW2-3), and a + pole of a LED through a current limiting resistor, like 1k etc. The - pole of the LED goes to the ground.
This way, when You turn on the bypass switch, the power goes from SW5-9, through SW5-8 to the led.
Like this: https://drive.google.com/open?id=11tbTpjOaM6u6Lpeincnst20OSseKLA7x
The red is +9, black is ground, and that ugly tube contains the resistor to te LED.
(don't mind the T/t wiring, it's wrong on this picture, sw3-1 and 3 are replaced)
Hi! Finally had enough time to finish. Mine works. I used the volume mods suggested by detrital fragments. Certain settings have lower volume than others but there's so much doing interaction I guess it's unavoidable. Also, each control is really responsive.
DeleteThanks!
Hey, glad to hear that! Have fun with it! I finished mine almost 2 months ago, but I use it every day, and it's still fun, and surprising.
ReplyDeleteSo what about the treble/bass? Are they working in yours? Especially the treble, because the bass is only responsive, because of the LFO, it behaves like a depth pot if there is LFO on. In ours, the treble does nothing. But I'm working on a mod: I'll replace it with a 'Tone Stack'. I'll come back with the results.
Welcome to the Swash Club, beware, because it's highly addictive ;-)