This was a request.
Original FSB thread and unverified schematic avilable here.
Update! The first link on the right of the bottom 13600 should go from the Base of 2N5087 to the Collector of the 2N5088.
Saturday 22 September 2018
Blackout Effectors Whetstone Phaser
" The vintage sound of an analog OTA-based phaser melded with contemporary
parameters out the wazoo. From classic and not-so-classic sounds,
subtle and over-the-top phase tones, mellow through seasick pitch
vibrato, ringmod, glitchy octave effects, and outright strange
phased/autowah/tremolo hybrid sounds you won't find anywhere else. No
doubt the Whetstone can do things that your current phaser can't "
This was a request.
Original FSB thread and unverified schematic avilable here.
Update! The first link on the right of the bottom 13600 should go from the Base of 2N5087 to the Collector of the 2N5088.
This was a request.
Original FSB thread and unverified schematic avilable here.
Update! The first link on the right of the bottom 13600 should go from the Base of 2N5087 to the Collector of the 2N5088.
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Yes! Thank you! Will be doing this next week as soon as I get some 12v zeners I had to order.
ReplyDeleteHOLY JESUS THAT IS BIG
ReplyDeleteWhat is it based on? Triple OTA sounds a bit like a Ross...
It's basically an OTA and ultra pimped out version of the Small Stone if I am not mistaken? I recall reading up trying to figure out SS mods and this is like if you FULLY decked one out. Could be wrong, but it is totally rad either way.
ReplyDeleteThe small stone uses OTAs, just as this does (it is based on the small stone)
DeleteThanks for this! Will 13700’s work?
ReplyDeleteA quick google search indicates it should. Give it a go ;)
DeleteI'm gonna use 13700's
ReplyDeleteWill this fit in a 1590bb enclosure? How are the toggle switch lugs numbered?
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteSwitches should be:
Delete1.....1-4
2.....2-5
3.....3-6
Has anyone built this yet?
ReplyDeleteI'm cutting the board now. I'm kinda busy but should have it together in a couple days.
ReplyDeleteWell, I got it all together and it doesn't work. Led won't turn on and signal only passes when in vibrato mode. The level knob is the only one working (the trimpot is adjusting volume also). It's late here so I'm going to sleep. I'll look and see if I screwed up somewhere. So far I don't see anything, but with fresh eyes that may change.
ReplyDeleteIts not working right now. Seems like a problem in the lfo. Getting some variation in sound from the different switch positions and pot settings, but no lfo movement.
ReplyDeleteFound a small error in the layout: The first link on the right of the bottom 13600 should go from the Base of 2N5087 to the Collector of the 2N5088.
DeleteIt's been updated.
I moved up the link. Still not working. I wish I could figure this out but my limited knowledge is of no help here. Bummer.
ReplyDeleteI just spent the the last hour or so staring at the linked schematic, the linked pcb layout, and Alex's layout.
ReplyDeleteThey all appear to match with the exception of a 100uf for C21 rather than the 47u shown in the schematic. Also Alex didn't populate D2, C3, the "dry out" or "DIV" connections, none of which would kill the effect.
My guess is either the source layout has errors, which in turn means the schematic and Alex's layout have the same errors, or some troubleshooting is needed with both Mulekicker's and onthetundra's builds.
Sorry, not much help I know...
Do either of you have an audio probe? If so, I might be able to help you track down the issue.
I'll most likely give this a go myself, hopefully we can work it out together.
I stupidly do not have an audio probe (need to rectify that). I'm gonna go over my build with a fine toothed comb tonight. Fyi, on fsb the guy who originally posted did say his works 100%. Also, I used 13700's, could that be an issue here? If so, I'll order some 13600's.
ReplyDeleteI found this comment about the 13700 in diystombox:
DeleteTo apply what RG and Paul have stated, I repaired a Ross Phaser (USA) where all of the opamps were replaced with LM13700. The phaser was weak and didn't have much life to it. Per the schematic, all of the IC's are LM13600. I replaced the IC's with the LM13600 and the pedal came alive. Obviously, the circuit was designed around the 13600. I didn't pursue investigating this any further but I sure noted it in my repair log.
After a 2 minute test, everything appears to be working.
ReplyDeleteWell done as usual Alex!
Have not checked out all the switches yet.
I'll be able to check it out thoroughly later today.
I used 13700's, every thing else per the layout.
I'd say tag it Alex, everything except the "fix" position is working perfectly.
ReplyDeleteAccording to the schematic, the "fix" position grounds out the base of Q6 and pin 12 of U3, and then supposedly the Rate control will adjust the "cocked" wah tone.
In my build, the Rate control does nothing in the "fixed" mode. However, if I float the base and pin 12 instead of grounding them, then the Rate control does alter the tone. (eliminate the SW1-4 connection)
Grounding out pin 12 just doesn't make sense to me.
Now, it's time to try out a couple mods I'm considering...more on those later.
Awesome. Now I just gotta figure out where i fucked up. Gonna reflow some joints. So, you're saying just get rid of the sw1-4 connection? Thanks MAO!
ReplyDeleteLet me know if I can help, voltages etc.
DeleteYes, for me it seems omitting the Sw1-4 connection is better than grounding it. So position 4 of the rotary has no connection.
Once you get yours going, let me know how the fixed mode sounds.
I just took another look at the layout at FSB, and even though pad 4 on the pcb layout is wired per the schematic, the offboard wiring picture shows lug 4 of the rotary is not actually connected to anything!
ReplyDeleteSo omit the SW1-4 connection.
Well, I'm an idiot! One of my middle 13700's didn't have a pin soldered in right. It's working perfect and is killer. Sorry, I shoulda been able to verify this 2 days ago, I need to stop debugging at 3am. You are absolutely right about doing away with sw1-4. Thanks Alex! Thanks MAO! Thanks dude over at FSB! The pads setting on this is worth the build alone in my opinion.
ReplyDeleteCool! Thanks Michael.
DeleteOriginal IC is NE5517N x 3
ReplyDeleteAll TR is Fairchild.
http://www.blackouteffectors.com/wp-con ... nual_1.pdf
The FIX setting kills the LFO completely.
In this setting the RATE knob will manually sweep through different points in the phasers sweep,
allowing for stuck-wah- like sounds, hollow telephone effects, and provides overall different approaches to tone shaping.
Thanks.
could someone be so kind as to post working values for the 13600's and tranny's? mine is working but its a very faint effect so far.
ReplyDeleteHere you go
ReplyDeleteLM13700 (both)
1 - 1.2 16 - 1.2
2 - 0 15 - 0
3 - 3.6 14 - 3.6
4 - 3.6 13 - 3.6
5 - 4.75 12 - 4.75
6 - 9.05 11 - 0
7 - 4.75 10 - 4.75
8 - 3.6 9 - 3.6
Transistors from left to right (readings top to bottom)
5088 C-8.45 B-3.4 E-3.0
5087 C-5.68 B-8.4 E-9.0
5087 E~6.7 B~6.3 C~6.4 (varies)
5088 C~6.3 B~1.8 E~1.25(varies)
5088 E-1.8 B-2.3 C-9.0
5087 E~6.7 B~6.4 C~6.4 (varies)
2n7000 D-7.4 G-3.4 S-1.7
Sorry I must be missing something on the diagram. Where does SW 3 - 3 connect to?
ReplyDeleteSW3-3 is not connected, only lugs 1 and 2.
DeleteIt's listed as an spst, so it only has 2 poles. It seems that, like me, you're using a 3 pole spdt. If thats the case, just leave pole 3 unconnected.
ReplyDeleteThank you! Yeah I missed that and ordered the SPDT by accident. Can't wait to try this out.
ReplyDeleteFirst off, thank you for posting this amazing layout! I'm sure it took some serious effort to squeeze it all in here!
ReplyDeleteMy question is regarding the rotary switch. I ordered the 3P4T rotary from Small Bear and I've got a switch with pins 1-12 and pins marked A B and C. The layout only shows pins 1, 2, 3, and A connected though. Am I missing something? What do I do with the other 9 pins of this switch?
Hey Aaron,
DeleteThose addition pins are not used or connected to anything.
If they made a 1P4T rotary, thats all you would need.
There are mini 2P4T rotary switches that work well as they are smaller than the 3P4T, but again only pins A,1,2 and 3 are used.
Great, thank you for clarifying. I just thought it odd that the layout specified that Switch 1-4 was not used but didn't mention that pins 5 through 12 also aren't connected to anything! I'm going to get started on this one soon, it's such a great sounding phaser.
DeleteSorry for my ignorance but what is CLR? It looks like a resistor for color and body in the layout, but I have no idea what it is.
ReplyDeleteCurrent limiting resistor for your led. You pick the value based on how bright you want it. I almost always use 4.7k's but you may wanna go higher if you are using a super bright.
ReplyDeleteIt's so obvious that I feel idiotic xD Thank you very much, Mulekicker!
DeleteIm sorry, i want to build this nice little thing. But I dont understand the comments to connect the switches and potentiometers. There are only numbers and I dont know how to connect. At the Dyna Comp i have had an circuit plan and i understand how to connect the input, the output and the Potentiometer. Here I have no plan. please help me...
ReplyDeleteOh, sorry, my name is Thomas from Germany
ReplyDeleteNow it´s me again, is there everywhere a Layout to make a PCB? I try it out two times to fix it from the circuit above, but no funktion at all. But if I can make me a PCB by myself I will be happy.
ReplyDeleteoh good gravy... I built this sucker... it took me a while to debug it but I think one of my 13700s was bad.. it finally works and guess what.. I now have too many options with this circuit... so many sounds... so many good sounds... and it is sooooo big....
ReplyDeleteHa! Yeah, it's big for sure. I still use mine, mainly as a super slow phaser but I also really like the ring mod sounds you can get. Especially with a fuzz out front.
ReplyDeleteThis is a great sounding Phaser, many thanks to Alex for posting it.
ReplyDeleteI especially love the vibe sounds.
My built is generally working well but has some problems. When the stages switch (number 4) is in 4-3, 4-6 position there is no effect signal. Furthermore, there's always (despite the position of stages) a ticking noise in the background, which gets faster and louder the more you increase the speed knob. The depth knob has a very weak effect on the signal. Everything else is working perfectly.
I double checked all connections, LM13700 and transistors but can't find any fault.
Is the stages and depth knob working in your built? Does anybody have the same problem with the ticking noise?
Can't say mine has that issue. It is quite, all the switches work as the orig unit does.
DeleteHi Ted,
Deletethanks a lot. so i will start a new round of debugging...
Is there a wiring diagram for the 3p4t rotary? The one I’ve had delivered has 15 lugs numbered 1-12 and A,B and C. On the layout the only lugs that are mentioned are lugs 1-3 on the board, 4 not connected and A to ground. What about all the other lugs? Have I got the wrong type of switch?
ReplyDeleteBuilt this huge thing in a 1590PP, which is about double the height of the 1590 standard enclosure.
ReplyDeleteI found it really useful so I could fit all the circuitry and not worry about squeezing parts together, but the even better part is that the extra height makes it perfect for a back row, really easy to fit in my board without a pedal riser.
By the way, it would be great to re-tag it as "Blackout Effectors". The search on the right panel does not include this build as it is now.
Cheers!
This thing was a nightmare to construct but it's very cool. Some of the settings are subtle but it's capable of a lot of very usable and interesting sounds. Thanks for the sexy layout.
ReplyDelete